150 Million Pounds of Pressure
Ian McCaw, Jay Jacobs, and Tommy McClelland on quick decisions, big budgets, and the community of Athletic Directors in a world of isolation.
We all know that sports has become big business and no sport has seen as rapid growth as college athletics. Gone are those days when a retired coach kept the seat warm as the athletic director.
Budgets today have grown to over one hundred and fifty million dollars, with staffs topping two to three hundred people. The pressure is enormous and the expectations are high. On today's episode, we hear all about it.
Join us as we catch up with not one, not two, but three current and former athletic directors, Jay Jacobs from the University of Florida, Ian McCaw from Liberty University, and Tommy McClelland at Louisiana Tech. All jumped in to give us a peek behind the curtain of being a college A.D. As always, thanks for listening.
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Episode Transcript
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Henry Kaestner: Welcome back to the Faith Driven Athlete podcast. This is the time for us to get together with some great leaders in the world of sports and learn lessons on faith and sports, of course. And over the course of the last several episodes, as you've gotten introduced to the world of Faith Driven Athlete, we've talked to some really, really great and famous athletes and coaches. And yet we all know, of course, that there is a group of leaders behind them. They make all the things they do possible running some very, very large businesses. And there is a ministry that I hadn't heard a whole lot about called AD athletic directors for Christ. And these are men and women that are focused on their faith first and foremost, but also see their positions and their platforms as a way to be able to do excellent work in a way that brings glory to God and brings glory in many cases to their schools that are competing at the very highest level. So we've got a really special episode. So we've got three of them on this podcast and we're going to introduce each of them we're actually going to have them introduce each other. And just hearing a little bit about their stories and who they are. So without further ado Ian, Jay, and Tommy, thank you very much for joining Justin and I on the show today.
Jay Jacobs: It's a blessing to be here. Thank you. I'm glad to be with you.
Henry Kaestner: One thing we love to do at the top of every episode is to give our guests a chance to talk about who they are and a little bit of their personal journey. The ups and downs have gotten to where they are today and a couple of minutes. If you guys could just give us an overview about who you are and some of that and Ian why don't you lead us often and maybe Jay can follow.
Ian McCaw: Ok. I'm Ian McCaw. I am the director of Athletics at Liberty and am fortunate to serve as a Division 1 athletic director for 23 years at four different schools. So, I guess that means you can put me in the dinosaur category. I've been around a long time and fortunate to also be great friends with Jay and Tommy and Lee. And it's a privilege to be with you today. But my wife Heather and I have four children and they are all college age or beyond, and we have a Baylor graduate. We have a Liberty graduate and we have two that are currently at Samford down in Birmingham. So very blessed with a wonderful family. An honor to be with you today.
Henry Kaestner: Well, thank you. Thank you very much. Jay bring in on, please.
Jay Jacobs: Absolutely. Thank you for having us on. My name is Jay jacobs. I'm one of the executive associate athletics directors at the University of Florida. I spent the majority of my career at Auburn University, last 13 there as the athletics director. I've been At Florida now going on my third year and that's a blessing to be there. Finished high school in Jacksonville, Florida, went to Auburn and getting a chance to come back to Florida was, not many people get a chance for second homecoming, but I did because of Scott Strickland, the great folks at the University of Florida. I grew up in the church and then I went to college and I never darkened the door of a church. And through God's grace and sovereignty, he brought a woman to me, Angie, and we got married 10 years after high school and started to go back to church. And I got saved in 1993, where actually I actually got saved when I was 16, but it didn't stick. In 1993, I made Jesus Christ, our lord and savior, the Lord of my life. And we have three daughters, Hayley, Megan and Janie. It's a blessing to be a part of this, and it's a blessing to be a part of the ministry that God has placed each of us in. So thank you for having me.
Henry Kaestner: Well, we're glad you're here. And Tommy, why don't you introduce yourself as well, please.
Tommy McClelland: Yeah. Well, again, just a pleasure to be here and to be with you all. Yeah. You know, it's been a little bit of a journey for me as well. Not quite as broadly traveled. I guess you would say, as is Ian and Jay.
I've stayed primarily in the state of Louisiana. Grew up in south Louisiana. Had the opportunity to go to Northwestern State University where I played football and also threw the javelin on the track and field team. And I think it was during that period of time in my second year in college where I originally I thought I wanted to be a coach, where, you know, I really kinda was opened up to this idea of athletic administration. I went to a small school in high school. And we did not have a business office, if you will like most high schools. And I was enamored by what I saw at the college level and I begin to change my focus to more of an athletic administration. And it was also around the same time that God just began to stir in my life. And I was already saved, but I really publicly confessed my desire to serve him in a way that will give my life to the ministry. Well, when you hear that, most people assume that that means you're going to go preach on a pulpit. And I was really struggling with that because it did not feel God leading me to preach. But yet I did feel led to minister. And there was this convergence, if you will, in my life at that time where I saw the opportunity to be at an athletic administrator as a way to minister. And so I left there. I did go spend nine months in Texas at the Southwest Conference Office where I interned to finish out my master's degree. And then I struggled with where I would go. I applied for jobs all over the country. And lo and behold, winded up being in Lake Charles, Louisiana, is an entry level position. And then just the providence and the sovereignty of God. At twenty five years old was given the opportunity to be the interim athletic director at McNeese with really very just very frankly and objectively no experience. I mean, I was about nine months of experience and was given the opportunity to lead. And then a year later, the interim title was removed and served at McNeese for about seven years and then had the opportunity to stay within my home state and come to Louisiana Tech, in which I've been here now seven years, almost eight years since I've been at Louisiana Tech. And so it's been a long journey, but a short story.
Justin Forman: So, Jay do me a favor. Talk to us about ADs4Christ. Tell our listeners a little bit about what you guys do, how it got started and the origin story.
Jay Jacobs: OK. We're having our fourth annual get together in July, July the 24th in Nashville this summer. So about four years ago, about this month, Lee De Leon and I became dear friends. And we talked often and we talked about our own lives and what God was doing in our life. And Lee was the athletics director at, Abilene Christian. And I was the athletics director at Auburn we talk about the struggles of being an AD. And how do you have your Christian faith and how do you walk that and show that. And also being such a competitive environment where things don't go well, people aren't very nice. It's hard to love your neighbor sometimes as we're commanded to do. We're going to talk about that. We've got to talk about, you know, there's more than just us out there that need this. We talked about this, have something in the summertime and get people together. We talked about it probably for about six months and we got to about this time of year four years ago, we said, you know what? This is on our heart. We don't have all the details, but we're going to do it. So we had the first one in Dallas, Texas, four years ago this coming July. And we had about twenty six people, I believe come just sent an e-mail out to random people that we knew that we thought were believers or they may be impacted by this ministry. And then the second year we had about thirty five. And then last year we had almost 80 people. And so that's what it's about. It's about college administrators specifically. But all are welcome in athletics to come in and, you know, use Proverbs 22, Iron sharpens iron, and just like on this podcast, we find out that we're not alone. There are a lot of Christian leaders out there in college athletics, in athletics in general. Just sometimes we struggle with our platform because about balance, what we're trying to do. And we will change that. We want people to be encouraged. We want young athletic administrators and old athletic administrators to know that, you know what? You're not alone. You know, that's why God sent out the disciples two by two, y'all pair up and you'll be together. That's what ADs for Christ is all about. Lee De Leon was the catalyst behind it. And we got it going. And thanks to him and our other13 board members, it's a thriving ministry that God is blessing.
Justin Forman: That's great. Thanks for sharing. You know, it's unique. We've got so many people here on the podcast hearing and obviously we talk about community. It's clear that you guys have that. You know, we interview a lot of athletes, entrepreneurs and business leaders that talk about the common thing that they struggle with loneliness or isolation. Just talk for a minute. Ian and Tommy, just what does it look like for you guys to live faithfully in community, both maybe just in your church level and in this community that's growing within you guys?
Ian McCaw: You know, I think certainly this ministry. ADs for Christ has been a great opportunity for us to unite believers within the field of college athletics. And again, I really give Lee and Jay just great credit for the vision, this organization. But this is a field where, you know, in many times you have to seek out believers because certainly not as prevalent as we would like it to be. But I think that's one thing that this ministry been incredible about us. We've been able to forge relationships and find opportunity to fellowship with people who otherwise may never have met and don't interact with on a regular basis. And I think that's been one of the real blessings of the time that we've had.
Tommy McClelland: Yeah, I would echo that same sentiment, but also just, you know, when you talked about, you know, in your home and in your local church community, you know, it's very important. I remember being in McNiece and calling Ian for advice on, you know, work life balance and how do I do that? And I wanted his biblical perspective. He was at Baylor at the time and matter of fact, I actually drove out and spent some time with him in Waco. But, you know, just making sure that you're creating that balance and that, you know, you are a father, your husband, you also are an athletic director. And how do you create that balance? And then for me, making sure that I do find someone within the community that's not necessarily connected to the department and quite frankly, doesn't care if we won the game last night, but they can sharpen me. And I've most of the time found that either in our church or through the Fellowship of Christian Athletes or some organization like that, where they're just there to be supportive because, you know, as an AD, sometimes you always wonder what's someone's angle and you just don't want them to be worried about, you know, hey, why'd that coach leave? But let's go ahead and pray anyway right now, you know. I mean, I just want him to be kind of sterile from that fandom as I need someone to confide in at times.
Henry Kaestner: Now, there's gonna be a fair number of our listeners and are going to have a sense of what an athletic director is. But let's start at the beginning and Ian just give us an overview. What is an athletic director and how does that role change or let's say 20, 25 years?
Ian McCaw: Well, the job has grown exponentially over the years. Again, I mentioned I've been doing this for 23 years and the increased visibility, the finances, the high stakes of today's college athletics have really changed the job so that the days of the old kind of retiring coach serving as a director of athletics are long gone. And today's ADs need to be brand managers. They need to be savvy with social media technology. They need to be very skilled at acquiring resources, raising funds. And they also need to have solid business acumen. So it's a skill set that not a lot of people have. But one of the constants, I guess, in the job is that it still comes down to people. I think you can succeed with having the best people, whether that's coaches, administrators, support staff and internal recruiting, the best student athletes to your institution to allow your programs to thrive. So in terms of the job itself, I think one of the most enjoyable aspects of it is the variety. The no two days that are exactly the same, each of us get to take on different challenges. Certainly none of us ever envisioned that the last couple of weeks it's been a lot of learning for all of us and ensuring ideas. And, you know, some activities that I think we all enjoy the most are interacting with our fans and our donors. Working on facilities projects is a big part of the job, developing budgets, and really just serving your coaches and student athletes are some of the aspects that I think are most desirable.
Justin Forman: Jay, I want to jump in here. You mentioned you were previously at Auburn and now at Florida. So you're no stranger to the big business of college sports. I mean, in reference to just some of the growth and the change that's happened, you know, many of our listeners might not even know the scale of the budgets. I mean, some of these budgets, we're talking about 150 million dollars in revenues. What does that mean for the structure? Just walk us through an athletic department. What's the staff look like? Kind of. How is the big game of college sports changed?
Jay Jacobs: Sure. Well, speaking about the budget, particularly when I took over as athletics director at Auburn in 2005, our budget was 42 million dollars. And when I left there two years ago, it was 140 million. And today at Florida and Auburn it's 150 million dollar budget. The structure continues to change because the demands and the goal of excellence we have for our student athletes academically and also competitively and also the structure we put around them. Back in the day, you never had a nutritionist, you didn't have specialized strength coach for each sport. You didn't have mental health advisors. When I played it all with one academic counselor for the entire athletic department. And now all of those areas have grown exponentially as they should because they require much of student athletes. What we expect of them and what our fans and donors expect an athletic departments is to provide excellence at the highest level. And with that excellence comes a demand and an appetite to support athletics. That's why we're able to have these television contracts, these bowl games, these multimedia rights holders pay us the money, they pay enough so that athletics can continue to keep up with the demands and expectations we all have. For our studentathletes and out fans and most particularly our institutions. It is, you know, college athletics to me is the front porch of the institution at Florida or anywhere else across the nation. No university could afford the publicity, sometimes is negative, I understand that, but the positive publicity that an athletics department provides, for its institution, those things have to work hand-in-hand. It takes a tremendous amount of resources to do that. So the structure could be anywhere from, at Auburn we had about 200 employees and at Florida because it's incorporated differently, about 350 employees because they're so separate 501c3 but we're all about the same. We have those same support staff and people that are helping us create excellence. We have high expectations for our student athletes and for our fans, for our employees and for the brand that we're representing.
Justin Forman: So Ian I want to come back to you. Talk to us a little bit about scale. I mean, you've been a part of you mentioned four different schools. Some of those that you've taken to that next level as they've been growing the athletic department. You're in a situation now at liberty, where football is becoming a bigger deal. What's that entrepreneurial venture like trying to keep up in such a big sports industry?
Ian McCaw: Yeah, just I've been fortunate to serve at some institutions that have been in growth phases during my tenure. And I was certainly the case at Baylor when I started in 2003. The budget was twenty six million dollars. And by 2016 it was over 100 million. So similar to the growth that Jay described. We're very blessed with generous support from donors who contributed close to $400 million to fund facilities and programs, and that allowed our program to really thrive. And I personally feel God's gift to me and enabled me to thrive in a growth type of environment more so than a maintenance situation. And it's very similar to what we are working on here at liberty. We've opened over $100 million worth of athletic facilities since we started here three years ago. So at the same time, with those resources and with that commitment come expectations to perform at a high level. And we've been fortunate here to move from FCS to FBS Football and during our inaugural year We reached a bowl game and won it. So our program from football standpoint is thriving and we've won back-to-back championships in men's basketball. So it's exciting to work in that type environment and hopefully we can continue to enjoy some success.
Justin Forman: Tommy, let's take it over to you. You've heard Jay and Ian talk about just the size of the scope, the growth. You know, one of the youngest athletic directors probably in history of the NCAA. How have you dealt with that pressure? What has that journey been like for you?
Tommy McClelland: It's been a journey. You know, when I first became an AD, I mean, there was a lot of skepticism even within our own community and certainly, you know, a lot of critiques. You know, but my father was not an athletic administrator. They worked for the federal government, but he gave me great advice early on. He just said, you know, you're going to have to have thick skin and an oily back.
And he just meant you're just going to have to let a lot of things go like, you know, you've got put in this position of leadership. And I would learn a lot from my father. The main thing is just trying to do things with integrity. When you come to that point in the road in which tough decisions have to be made, which, you know, if you're in any type of leadership, you're going to get put in that position. It's never wrong to do the right thing. And that comes with pressure because, you know, we have stakeholders, we have expectations to win. And that's where usually a lot of the pressure comes in. But, you know, I think over the years, you know, now I guess approaching 13, 14 years as an AD., it's less of an issue now. But early on, I was very conscientious of what I would wear, how I would say things when I'd go to an event just because people were expecting you to be immature. They were expecting you to do something that would show your youthfulness and your inexperience in those things. And so I was very mindful of not that I'm looke now, but, you know, I mean, I wore a suit and tie by the first three years, every single day that I went to work, just because I didn't want anyone to say, you know, well, there's their young AD wearing a polo shirt. You know, it just is practical. Is that is it was very conscientious for me. I do think being an dAD is like dog years. So I'm like one hundred and forty five years old now. So I'm not that young anymore. But I do think when I think about my age and I use this opportunity all time to talk about this, I think about First Corinthians, chapter one, verse twenty six. And when basically, you know, it talks about really when it says not many of you were wise by human standards. Not many were influential, not many were of noble birth. I was not of noble birth. I didn't get the job because my father was an AD or because he was a football coach or that I had some pedigree in this business. Quite frankly, if we continue to read, God chooses the foolish things of the world to shame the wise. I mean, the reality is I have no business being an AD at twenty five year old. That's the fact. I mean, I did not have a business or have any reason to do that. But for some reason, God chose my president to see something in me to use it as a way to bring attention to him. Because how else could you explain a twenty five year old being given the reins of an athletic department?
Henry Kaestner: Incredible. Ian and Jay, both of you guys have moved on to schools that then competed against your old schools. I know Liberty pulled off a major upset at Baylor and Jay, Florida got the best Auburn this past fall. What are those emotions like competing against a previous school where you're in leadership?
Well, when I was at Baylor, we did we executed a contract to play Liberty as our annual FCS game to open the 2017 season, and never in my wildest imagination did I think that I would end up in the AD at Liberty. When that game was played, otherwise it would have given Liberty a much larger guarantee. Going into that game as more than thirty five point underdog and actually pulled off what at the time was the biggest point spread upset in college football history. It has since been surpassed, but it was really a very emotional homecoming for me as such a treat to see and spend time with so many of my Baylor colleagues and friends and donors. Everybody was very warm and gracious both before the game and even after the game. I received so many calls and text of congratulations and certainly very proud of our Liberty coaches and student athletes. They worked very hard to prepare for that game. They knew there was a little extra riding on it and they did a tremendous job, executed a great game plan Liberty's first win ever over a top five opponent. I think everybody except Justin was probably happy with that outcome, but there was certainly a fun night.
Henry Kaestner: I'm sure it was. Jay talked to us about your experience, too, with the big Auburngame.
Yeah, well, it started back Henry about a year ago in the SEC tournament where the Auburn Men's team played the Florida men's team in the SEC tournament and I was sitting there in the stands, then Auburn came to the Swamp this past fall. And it was a really odd day. The reason it was odd was because I had never pulled against Auburn before. And I found myself in a most uncomfortable position at that because it just didn't feel natural, having grown up in Alabama and been an avid fan all my life. You know, the great thing about it is how I felt about it had nothing to with the outcome of the game. And so the Gators ended up with it. And my hope was that we would face Auburn in the SEC championship game. And neither one of those happened. But we did have a great year winning 11 ballgames. But it's different. You know, I've always looked at these coaches that go from one school to another and wonder how they did it. But you know what happened with me? Similar to what Ian mentioned is that the people at Florida were so sensitive to me in that day and just blessed me. It was an incredible blessing. They told me the week of the game. Don't you worry about Saturday will cover your responsibilities. And we know it's gonna be a different time for you. So you just enjoy the day. And it was just God's grace and a blessing to be at a place at the University of Florida, where people care. And certainly running into Auburn friends that week and the weekend was a blessing as well. So it's different. But, you know, fortunately, we don't determine the outcome of the game. And it was a fun time, but a real interesting time for me.
Henry Kaestner: Soo I want to switch gears a little bit and just ask all your actions and maybe, Tommy, you can start us off it. Anybody should jump in, of course. It's times like this where there's a worldwide tragedy going on and just a timestamp. We're recording this in the middle of the pandemic about Covid 19. So this is in early April of 2020. But when real tragedy happens, you know, I think back having lived in New York about the New York Yankees going back and playing baseball, and I think about sports being such an incredible diversion in a way for us to come together as communities. And yet that's something that's been taken away from us in this pandemic for obvious reasons. While they're obviously bigger, life threatening realities that we have to face, including now, the lack of sports makes this time feel for me, and our audience, I think much, it's strange and darker somehow. But talk to us a bit about times in your past when you have seen hardship going on, where getting out there and competing and working your hardest and being with teammates in front of fans, where has that been a release for you? Where has that been something where you've been able to go and really feel guys glory? I think back to the Chariots of Fire movie. When I compete, when I run, I feel God's glory. You've all been involved in athletics at the highest levels. Where has sports been that for you in the past?
Tommy McClelland: One of my favorite quotes, by the way. And when I win I feel his glory to win is to honor him, to not is to hold him in contempt. And so I think, first of all, I want to say broadly and specifically. Broadly, I think that Jay, Lee, Ian and all of us on this call, we do that every day when I have a bad day. Do you know how I help usually cure it? I'll go out to practice. And so that's the luxury of being an athletic administration, is if I've just had a really tough day, maybe it's just a routine kind of grind day. You know, maybe there's been a tragedy, maybe there's been something you deal with and you finally get to that point where you can kind of close your laptop and go somewhere for me. That somewhere is practice. It may be tennis practice. It may be basketball practice or football, but that's what that is for me. I think more specifically to answer that question for you, as I was a student athlete in 2001 and I had a tremendous coach who probably made one of the biggest impacts on my life. His name was Steve Roberts. He left Northwestern State to go be the head coach at Arkansas State. Tremendous man of God, just incredible man of character and showed me a lot about myself as a man. But he was our head coach during 9/11. And his compassion and his words to us that day and guiding us through that were incredible. And then for us, quite frankly, to just get back on the field to practice. And then the game that we had following that, the therapeutic nature of that I shared that with my staff today as we had a Zoom call that not now because of the pandemic, but at some point sports are going to be a part of the therapeutic process in this country and frankly, all across the world in which we can kind of come together and unite as one under this idea of sports. And so although that's somewhat superficial, Christ is in sports, he's everywhere. And so we've got to figure out ways that we can use that as a way to bring hope, not just hope that we can win, but hope to humanity in a different way. But there's going to be a unifying force that's going to occur at some point the future.
Justin Forman: That's great, Tommy. So we talk about the therapeutic nature of it. And there's also kind of another side to that conversation that this pause is maybe giving us the chance to to see some of those good things that sometimes outside of the proper context can become kind of idols. There's no doubt that sports in our culture has a just a huge place and sometimes people have a nature to turn to that maybe more than turning to God. How do you guys see this time in this unique season that we're in is a chance to recalibrate a little bit, to love the gift that God has given us, but to not worship the gifts?
Ian McCaw: I think there are a lot of lessons that are going to be learned through this pandemic that we're going through right now. And God can use this time. He's going to use it to mold and shape us as believers. He's also going to use it to bring many others who are searching right now for hope into his kingdom. And I heard from a friend about a church in Texas where they've had over thirteen hundred professions of faith since the start of the pandemic.
And this is a season of life that we're all going through. And I think it's a time where we're able to pause, reflect on what's really important. And that's, first and foremost, our relationship with Christ. It's a time that we get to invest a bit more with our families than we would otherwise with the nature of our jobs and, you know, perhaps renew some friendships. People you haven't talked to in a while. I've had some people reach out to me, I have spoken to in years. And just with a little bit extra discretionary time right now, I think it also allows us a time to really again, be grateful for the blessings of the Lord's poured out for us and be thankful for what we've been blessed with.
Justin Forman: It's great. So, you know, like you guys had mentioned at some point things get restarted and we start up again. And when you think about restarting, just even in this situation and just even think of your guys unique roles that God has, you know, expectations are a funny thing. Maybe in college sports, it's an always shifting conversation. But do you guys ever had those moments where you're sitting down with staff or the presidents saying, hey, here's our expectations. You have a list of KPIs from revenue and graduation rate attendance that you go through week to week, month to month. What is that part of your job like?
Jay Jacobs: I think that we all have strategic goals. And I think those usually stay the saying from year to year now with uncertain times like this. The action items to complete those goals might change. But, you know, you talk about your goals of graduating student athletes, getting compliance, managing your money properly, having a great game day experience. You talk about those things and, you know, with things like this change. You know, we have to change. We have to adjust. Our action might change a little bit where they are. Student athletes should be educated here. University of Florida, completely different ways doing it online. So we provided the resources and the best opportunity for them to be successful. Some people thrive in that environment, so people don't show up to adjust what they talk about from a compliance well-trod. Understanding what we can or can't do with these student athletes off campus. So going to be compliant with the rules. But now with this new set of circumstances, what can we do? What should we do? So all those things are always about your core goals are always usually the same. But the action items may change because just like in your Christian walk, you know, you read the Old Testament, the Israelites bless their heart. They're just like me, sinners. You know, they'll get on the right path, get the right leader, then all of a sudden 25 years or 12 years later, they'll change and they'll go back to worshiping some idol. So I think that when you have something like this, when you have something that maybe you've taken for granted, I think it gives you the opportunity to reset it, put more things in perspective, just like coming out of 9/11. And, you know, I'll never forget when President Bush walked out and threw that pitch out at the New York Yankee Stadium. I mean, the United States erupted. College athletics and athletics in general, is a unifying place for people. Just keep it in perspective. None of this is eternal, but we have an eternal platform. We can use this to show going through tough times. You know, that's part of it. You know, we were talking earlier about pressure. You want pressure. If you're doing stuff that doesnn't include pressure, you're probably not moving the needle anywhere. So these jobs are tough. Their pressure-filled. But the rewards or exponential and it is just by God's grace that each of us get an opportunity to, in some small way, impact some student athlete or some staff members life and show them a bright light in the dark world.
Henry Kaestner: With you all in leadership of an athletics department and getting together as ADs for Christ. What does it look like this set a tone within in some cases, you know, Jay talked abouthaving 350 employees? What does it look like the love on those employees well? And are there opportunities for ministry? Can you have chaplaincy? I know the chaplains are such a big part of professional sports. How do you see that come into the ranks in the college game and how do you love and lead your athletes, your coaches, your employees in a way that points and tries to nurture them in their spiritual health as well?
Jay Jacobs: You know, I think ministry takes on many different forms. And there is a song that says they'll know you're Christians by your love. And there are those of us that hold Bible studies, become part of ADs for Christ, be a part of FCA, have chaplain, go to devotionals, all those things, you know, I ran into a guy yesterday. And he knew who I was. We spoke to each other and he said, I really appreciate your faith. And I began to wonder, how does he know that I'm a Christian? How does he know that? Well, it's because we have an annointingthat the Holy Spirit is in us. And so I would encourage those that felt led to do a devotional and those outwardly things. But it's how you treat people and how you show the love of Jesus in everything that you do every day, which is really challenging in college athletics. But I want to encourage people listen to this podcast that you don't have to suppress who you are. You don't have to be politically correct in everything that you do. You can show people the love of Jesus Christ through your actions and your words. And that's what this podcast is about. This what ADs or Christ is about. Is that encouraging one other to be who they are, where they are. Do it with your personality. God will give you the words. And so that's what I believe, the encouragement. Because when I became an AD, I had been a Christian. But about 10 years and I was wondering how in the world, am I going to do this? How am I going to be a Christian? And God put on my heart verse proverbs. Twenty nine. Twenty six, I believe it is said many seek the rulers pleasure, but all men will answer before God. And that's what I try to live by each day. You know what? These things will just have to fall by the wayside. But God's got me. God has you. God has us. He expects us to further his ministry and increase the kingdom.
Henry Kaestner: Well said. Ian? Tommy?
Ian McCaw: It's obviously different for me here, being at a Faith-Based School in Liberty. And I remember the first question I was asked at the press conference when I was hired, would I go ahead and just share my testimony, the press conference, so that that's probably not the question you get from most aides when they take over a new job. But certainly I'm blessed to work at a school where I can share my faith freely. I can integrate my faith into my job fully. And whether it's in youth service projects we do or department Bible studies or mission trips or student led ministry. And we're blessed with a lot of resources in terms what we're able to do with our student athletes in terms of encouraging and developing their faith. And that's not something I take for granted. And I really admire greatly the administrators who work at public schools. And the opportunity I had to interact with them at ADs for Christ because many of them are in environments where sharing their faith is not encouraged. And in fact, can be very detrimental to their career. Yet these people are very outspoken in their faith and great godly examples for the other staff and student athletes.
Tommy McClelland: Yeah. I mean, again, just at a public school, you know, to Ian's point. There's probably some things legally you just can't do. But to Jay's point, I mean, it's about, you know, being the hands and feet. And you can do that and minister to people. You know, when at time of crisis happens, when you have three hundred employees like Jay has or 300 plus or 200 employees that we have, roughly, there is going to be someone that's going to have an issue. There is going to be inevitably some type of crisis that's occurred in their life.
A grandmother has died or someone is sick and you just have an opportunity to minister to them, ask them, hey, can I pray for you? The most spiritual non-spiritual person. They're usually not threatened by that, but it does allow you to know. And then just a follow up on that. Continue to say, hey, I want you know, I'm thinking about you. You have continued to pray for or when you pray for them that morning, you text them, prayed for you this morning. I think those type of things, if someone's in the hospital going to visit them again. As an A.D., you're not the pastor, but you can still shepherd. And how do you do that? You know, and I think just being mindful of that.
Henry Kaestner: Thank you all. We like to close out every episode we do, whether it's Faith Driven Entrepreneur or a Faith Driven Investor or Faith Driven Athlete with the same question, and we can ask all three of you this and that is. Is there something in God's word that you might have heard this morning or this week that you see is really making an impact in your life? And we know that God's word is alive. And is there something that you see or hear him speaking to you about from maybe your time in the Bible?
Tommy McClelland: I think I was actually sharing this with Jay this week. I listened to a sermon this week and it just talked about, you know, when Jesus came back from the sea and he was approached by the leader in the community about his daughter dying. And so then he was headed to the house to go heal, this young girl, this twelve year old girl and the woman who had been suffering for so long, she reached out, touched his garment, and he felt the power leaving. And so it's that scene. And he was unpacking that. It was just here's a woman who was in social distancing so she couldn't be around people. There was no known cure. That sounds familiar. And, you know, she was desperate. And the only thing that she could think of is I've just got to go. I'm gonna go touch him. I'm gonna go be with him. And I think Ian's point earlier, there are so many people that are coming to know Christ through this epidemic. And I think that just what we've got to keep in mind is this God's not caught off guard by the Corona virus. I mean, he is, you know, all knowing and it's a part of who we are. And it's gonna be used for his glory. And I think just about that situation and the desperation that was on her that moved her to go amongst all these people. And yet he still was so powerful that he singled her out. I think that's the other point, is that he called her daughter is the only time he's ever used that term in the Bible where he called her daughter. And, you know, I think there's just a lot of people seeking the Lord. There's a lot of people following Him, but there's a lot of people seeking. And and I just I was kind of struck by that this week.
Ian McCaw: We had a head coaches meeting earlier this week and our coaches were certainly were looking for some encouragement. There's a lot to be discouraged about if you watch the news and listen to so many of the reports out there. So I shared with them a verse out of Isaiah, Chapter 41, verses 9 and 10 and 13 that says I've chosen you and not rejected you. Do not fear. For I am with you. Do not be dismayed, for I am your God from the Lord, your God who takes hold of your right hand and says to you, Do not fear I will help you. We are going to get beyond this time. And this is a time, really, for all of us to lean into our faith and also to share our faith with others, because there are a lot of people out there that are feeling hopeless and discouraged. And this is a great time for believers to share the hope that we have through Christ.
Jay Jacobs: My wife and I were talking this morning. I'm reading right now judges and during her Bible time. First of all, she'd share with me something she saw on social media where it said, you know what, if you want to worship athletic events, I'll take those from you. If you want to be apart from your family, I pull all of you together. I know, it's not the case for everyone, but I know it. Ian's home. He has his four children there. My three girls are here for the first time ever. We'll pull those together. If you're worried about how you look, how you're working out, those type things will close all the gyms. And then she went on to say, we know the story of when Jesus got through eating and Mary Martha were there. And, you know, Martha gets up, starts cleaning up while Mary sits down and wants to hear what Jesus has to say. This is a season where we need to sit and listen to what Jesus has to say. We should do that every day. But he is taking something, as he always does, that is meant for evil, and if will take advantage of it'll be meant for good because we'll enrich our lives spiritually if we slow down and listen to heal more now. During this time, we have more time now to study the word than we ever had before and share it with our families we have had before. And going back to what I'm reading now, it judges. It is amazing how the same thing happens. The Israelites worship. Obey God, and then some years later they start worshiping idols and everything goes really, really bad. There's a terrible cleansing. And then they're back to it again. That's when we have to learn from that. And we know that God is a God of second chances, just like he was with Peter.
But we have to learn that the only consistent thing is Him. All this other stuff is not eternal and use this time, the devil has meant for disruption. Let's use it to glorify, heal, but fueling ourselves spiritually and with his word and with time, with family. So we don't forget how we got here and who has won the victory already.
Henry Kaestner: Amen.
Justin Forman: Guys, thank you so much for spending time with us. We're grateful to have you guys part of the show with us. We're thankful to be able to give me insight to the places where God has you the journey he's had you on me. Exciting work with A.D. for Christ and how the community that's been brought about through that. Guys, thank you so much for spending the time with us.
Jay Jacobs: Oh, Justin. We thank you for what you all are doing. What a blessing.