College Football in the Time of Covid
Bill Hancock, Executive Director of the College Football Playoff, Shares the Journey from BCS to National Champion
The College Football Playoff. It’s been around long enough for most of us to take it for granted...well, almost long enough.
Most of us still remember the BCS bowl series and all the controversies surrounding who the real national champion was. But thanks to today’s guest, Bill Hancock, the College Football Playoff is the culmination of the NCAA football season.
Today, Bill shared the origin story behind the CFP, and he also shared his personal testimony and how the death of his son affected his life and his faith. We were so grateful to get to sit down with Bill, and we think you’ll enjoy this conversation.
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Episode Transcript
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Henry Kaestner: Bill, thank you very much for being on the show with us today. I'm so excited for our listeners to hear your story. Could you talk to us about the journey that's taken you to be the executive director of the college football playoff?
Bill Hancock: Yeah, it's a real pleasure to be on with you guys. I appreciate you doing this. Appreciate your work. And you're making a difference in the world. So thank you for that. My journey. I'm from a rural town in Oklahoma and my mom was a church organist and my dad was the choir director. And we walked to church every Sunday and man, he just didn't miss. And I liked it. I like the music. I, by osmosis, got a little bit of the faith when I was a child and carried that through to my life. I went to college and needed a job, got a job in the athletic department at my university, the University of Oklahoma, as a student and fell into a fulltime job actually the semester before I graduated. And I'll never forget, the boss came up to me and said, hey, there's a full time job opening. We'd like you to take it. And I said, I don't think I want to go into college athletics. And he said, well, listen, we'll pay your tuition for this last semester. You only need one more semester to go. And I figured out it was one hundred and thirty eight dollars and it wasn't an awesome sum of money at the time. So I jumped all over the job for our and thirty eight dollars and that got me into college athletics, inherited and my father's daily newspaper. My brother and I did sign with our hometown, which was Hobert Oklahoma, and ran the newspaper for four years. But I got a chance to get back into athletics in the Big Eight conference. And so I left my legacy in the newspaper back home and moved my family to Kansas City, spent 11 years at the Big Eight, and then got invited to come and interview to be the director of the NCAA basketball tournament in a dream come true for me. And I was lucky enough to land that position, stayed there for 16 years. And then I got invited to come interview to be the director of the ABC. Yes. And that was another dream come true, to live and breathe college football 24/7 and was retained to do that. And after five years of that, of course, then we changed over to the college football playoff. So this will be my 16th year in college football. So 16 as director of the Final Four and now 16 here in college football. I am the luckiest person I know on this. Really, really been blessed and didn't do anything other than be in the right place at the right time. But one thing I remembered from all those Sundays was do unto others. And if you only need one guide book in life, I only could have one guide. That would be the one. The old golden rule. Man, you can't go wrong.
Henry Kaestner: No, you can't. No, you can't. So I want to talk to you a little bit about the formation of the college football playoff. So you're brought through college football. You've been with it for 16 years. You're the director of the BCS and clearly did a good job for that, so that with the next iteration in launching the college football playoff, that they made you the leader of that, but talked us through a little bit about that formation. Was there something about the BCS that you all that were involved in leadership saw that was flawed about it and saw it as a solution? What was going on and when did that conversation start and walk us through maybe some of the different options that you all were considering that led you to where you are today?
Bill Hancock: Yeah. You know, the business was really good for college football. We wouldn't have a college football playoff today if we hadn't had the BCS. Which we had for a full generation. We had a for 16 years. But toward the end, we all sense that there was what we called BCBS fatigue on the part of fans. They wanted a little bit more. We knew we didn't want to go too far with it, but we figured out a way to have a playoff. And when we started talking about it, this was two years before the B.S. end that we laid out options on the table. And there was a full spectrum going all the way from going back to the old bowl system that had existed before the BCBS s all the way across the chart to a big playoff of 8 or 16 team playoff. And we really just kind of narrowed it down from that and landed at four teams as a way to keep the focus on the regular season, not add too many more games for the student athletes. And they were so happy when all of our leaders came together and said, yeah, let's do it. And so being able to be on the ground floor of the creation and going through the options at the time and now being on the ground floor of actually getting to put it together as we enter year seven has just been one of the most remarkable things that certainly ever happened to me. And I would dare say that it could ever happen to anybody in sports. Again, I'm just very, very blessed.
Justin Forman: So should we read something into the fact that you were the commissioner of the Big Eight? Should we read anything to the number eight being a favorite number or is four, should we read anything into that?
Bill Hancock: Oh, that's very clever, but no one's asked me that before and no.
Justin Forman: All right. We had to try. So no system is perfect. But there's been a lot that a lot of people have really liked about college football playoff. Tell us about what from your perspective has really worked about this format.
Bill Hancock: It's extremely popular, players like it, coaches like it, reporters like it. Fans like it. It does keep the focus on the regular season and it allows us to have a tournament at the end of the year. But our regular season in college football, I dare say it's the best one. It's the most meaningful and the most compelling regular season in sports. And none of us wanted to do anything to take away from that. So that's the chief benefit of the CFP, is that it lets us have a tournament, but it's a tournament based on what happens during the regular season.
Henry Kaestner: So I want to hear from you a little bit about some of the other people that you lead with. And you've got an incredibly diverse group on your committee. You've got former national security advisers. You got four star generals and college football greats. From all decades. Who is a surprise to you? And you don't have to pick out your favorite child. But I mean, with a group of leaders like that who has surprised you by what they've brought in and really helped you to lead?
Bill Hancock: Well, we now, as I said, we're entering our seventh year and we've had 30 some members. Each one has brought something different to the table. Our philosophy is broaden out the group of people on the committee. We're the only sports committee that's ever had outsiders, quote unquote. When I worked for the NCAA Basketball Committee for those 16 years, well, those were all athletic directors or conference commissioners. And when we started this, we said, let's get a little broader representation. Let's go for university presidents. Let's go for journalists. Let's go for national security advisers. And the really the broad spectrum of opinions has really served us well in CFP. And you're right. I don't want to call out any individuals. But I will say that Condoleezza Rice contributed a tremendous amount to this committee. So did Barry Alvarez and Thomas Vernon just go down the list, Pat Haden football names. But then also people who you might not have associated with people. Mike Trengessi, the old commissioner of the Big East Conference, lots of brilliant people who've been involved, people who care, people who are willing to do the work to evaluate the teams during the season. And that's time consuming. But they all say to me, when I call to invite them to be on the committee, they all say, yes, I well, because I want to give something back to this game that has been so good for me. And I appreciate that so much when I hear that from people.
Justin Forman: So obviously, you guys get together in person, but is there a secret text thread? Is there a secret e-mail chain that you guys all communicate on quarter to quarter, halftime week to week during this season?
Bill Hancock: No, we don't. We intentionally don't communicate during the weekend. We want people to watch the games themselves and come to the meetings with their own opinions. We do send them a system where they can download games and watch on Sundays and Monday morning before the meeting. And there's the coolest thing. There's an element that we call cut down versions of games. And what that is, is all the commercials are taken out all the time between plays in between quarters and halftime. And you can watch a game in 40, 45 minutes. Well, that enables the committee members to really focus on the games themselves and to watch more games than they might have otherwise. So no conversation until they come into that meeting room on Monday. Noonish.
Justin Forman: So in the BCS era, there was a number we would always see the number. We see how close it was that was quantified to know how close they divide was to who is in and who is out. In college football playoff, it's different. We see the end results. We hear the statements of maybe how close it is, but it isn't as numerically based. Maybe it's because I'm a Baylor grad and I have to ask the question, how close were we or what's been the toughest call that you guys have had to make over the years?
Bill Hancock: Well, let me just say, Sic Em.
Justin Forman: Hey, there we go. All right. That's enough for me.
Bill Hancock: OK. Yeah. You know. You know, every year is different than some ERG by the circumstances of the season. A little bit more challenging for the committee the first year that you're talking about with Baylor and T.C.U, and wound up in Ohio State at the end. Baylor, and TCU just had not played the same caliber of schedule that Ohio State played and close. You know, it's hard to say about close because each decision is made by the committee as a group. But I will say there was a great deal of conversation that season. And you remember, of course, Baylor defeated TCU. Lots of people around the country thought TCU was better, but Baylor had the victory on the field.
Justin Forman: 61-58. But we're not counting.
Bill Hancock: It was a phenomenal game. And there was a little pass interference non-call early in the game. And I'm sure you don't remember it.
Justin Forman: In the cut version that you talk about. That 45 minute version that play just got cut out of it. I didn't see that one. I don't know what you're talking about.
Bill Hancock: Yeah, right. And then this year, for example, the most recent season, you know, the results of the games kind of played out in a way that it wasn't terribly challenging for the committee no matter what you do. There will always be a team five that's really disappointed and a team six and seven, et cetera. And just like when I was doing the tournament, when I started, we had 64 teams, Wells Team 65 and 66 and 67 were always very disappointed. So that kind of thing goes with the territory, obviously with our offices in Dallas we had Baylor and TCU, two neighborhood schools. I happened to be involved in that first year, but we have lots of friends on both campuses and all campuses around the country. So our goal is just to do the very best job, evaluate what happens during the season and then make decisions.
Justin Forman: So Bill, you have such unique life experience with so many years. With March Madness, you've had a chance to see these. The fact, the Cinderella element, what that brings to that postseason. Do you think there's a Cinderella is there a slipper here for the college football playoff? Will that happen in the form of a team that surprisingly gets in? Or will that not take place maybe till the field expands? If it does, someday, what is Cinderlla's role in the college football playoff?
Bill Hancock: I don't think much about Cinderella. Don't think about that too often. I would point out that the number one seed has not done very well in CFP. So you can make a case that the number fours are the Cinderellas.
Justin Forman: So give us a little bit of perspective of the year ahead. Picking the college football playoff is difficult under normal circumstances. Taking the college football playoff, assuming that we have a full season under these circumstances, even more challenging. What are some of the conversations that you guys are having as you think about the year ahead?
Bill Hancock: Well, as we talk today, it's only June. So a lot of things can change before the season. But we're certainly all planning to play the CFP semifinals and championship game on January one and eleven. And certainly hoping to do that and the decision about the regular season will be made by others. But our committee will be ready to deal with whatever comes down. And whatever happens, we'll just select the best teams. It's really not productive for me to speculate any more than that. We'll just deal with whatever we're handed and make the right decisions.
Henry Kaestner: Bill, I want to talk about something that you've written about a great tragedy that happened in your life and something that has really shaped your journey, your faith journey that you've written about. You've spoken about it publicly. A lot of people might not know that part of your story. Can you share that with us?
Bill Hancock: Yeah, we lost our 31 year old son in a plane crash. You know, just a nightmare that was real for us and we had to live it. Our son was a remarkable young man and he worked in the Basketball office at Oklahoma State. And one of their team planes crashed on the way back from one game in the University of Colorado. I could not have gone through that time without faith. We talked about the three F's that carried us through faith, family and friends and really in no particular order. But I cannot imagine walking that path without faith, without knowing that God has us in his hands and God is crying right along with us, who we heard from lots of amateur theologians who said God didn't want it to happen or God needed another trombone player or sports information director. And I don't buy that. God was mourning right along with us. And someone also said to me, what's your first question when you get to heaven? I know I'm going to be sitting on the front row and I'm going to raise my hand and I'm going to say, God, why were you so good to me and our family? Why did you give us such wonderful lives? And the grief does not go away. It's a rollercoaster. You know, you're up and down. You're up and down. You're up. And you might be up for a little while, but you know that down is going to follow. But because of your faith, you know that the uptime in life will follow, that we were lucky that we didn't have to be born again. We were already born. You know, we were there. We had our faith and we knew our God. And that was a lucky thing for us. And as I've talked to others who have come into grief, many are not that way. Many need to have a wakeup call. And that's great. Super. We just were not one that needed any convincing or any proof for there was no uncertainty for us. We know and we still do.
Henry Kaestner: Tell us about a day in the life of Bill Hancock. Now, tell us about you know, you've got a very, very real job that's got to be 14, 16 hours a day. But there's a lot more to what's going on in something in industry, if you'll allow me. As big as college football for the rest of the year. So what is it look like? What are the things that you and the committee and others are doing in, say, the offseason? Now you're getting ready to prepare, presumably. But what does a day in the life of Bill Hancock look like?
Bill Hancock: Well, there's never been an off season like this one, of course, but comes with Covid-19. But my staff and I are just proceeding as much as we can. As always, planning for a championship game in Miami. Planning for the season. There's all kinds of preparation that needs to be done. And we're up to our necks in getting ready for the season. Covid has added another layer, which is talking to people about what could happen. My feeling is don't enter in any speculation. I think it's a waste of time and probably counterproductive because no one knows. You know, one of the biggest things about the coronavirus for those of us in athletics has been the uncertainty. We're a business of black and white and certainty. You win and you lose and you gain this many yards and you've got to play again next week. And we're all now dealt with this paper and it's blank. And so learning to live with uncertainty is really important. And for me, it's keeping track of our staff, staying in close to staff, mostly to make sure that they're all doing okay. It's a scary time. And my philosophy is. You know, when you're in the middle of a blizzard, you think it's going to snow forever, but it's not. And this blizzard will end. And when it does, we'll be ready.
Henry Kaestner: So it feels like in your situation and probably you're looking at two blizzards at the same time as so many of the rest of us are. And COVID-19 and impacting spring football, recruiting, just really life on campus. But then on the heels of that, of course, the thing we're experiencing with race relations. When you think about college football and the way that we lift up schools and we lift up student athletes as leaders, how do you see this fall playing out with student athletes, wanting to express themselves in a different political views that they might have? What do you and other leaders in the industry, in college football, think about that? What are some of the conversations you're having now with your peers?
Bill Hancock: Well, the conversations are mostly centered around. Everyone needs the right to express himself or herself. And so let's be open. Let's listen. Let's primarily make sure we have a good dialog and recognize the right of folks to express themselves. One thing I've been reading that I really loved was the fact that people are talking about taking the day off. On Tuesday, November 3rd, giving athletes a day off from practice so they can go vote. And I have a feeling that we are going to enter into a new, more enlightened age, sadly, because of the tragedies. But I tend to find something good in everything. And I think this enlightenment will serve us well in our world for a long time to come. You know, after we lost our son, people said to me, wow, you're changing lives, by the way, you reacting to this and helping people. And yet we've paid an awful high price to be changing lives. But that's the circumstance we're in. And I sort of feel the same way about the social justice in our country. We all paid a steep price. But I do I think I see lots of hope out there and lots of coming together.
Justin Forman: Tell us a little bit about howyou bridge those conversations there, Bill, of what it looks like to express yourself and to deal with tragedy. One of the things I've heard about you was that one of the stories I've heard is just how you guys walked through losing your son. You went on a bike, race or journey couple of thousand miles. What was that journey like for you? What was that expression? How did that help you process through things?
Bill Hancock: Yeah, that was fascinating. I'm not an athlete. Lots of people in my position in administration of athletics are. But I was not. I was a musician. I was a piano player and a clarinet player and sax player. And I really thought I would go into music in some way. I loved classical music and still do. But someone said to me, Bill why don't you take up a sport, why don't you take up running. And I was probably 20, 21 years old. And there was a person I respected. John McCloud, who was later coach of the Phenix Suns. And John said, come, go running with me. Well, I turned that into a frankly and avocation and was a dedicated runner and a pretty good marathoner for a non athlete. Marathoners will recognize my time of three oh seven. My PR. And I loved running and had a serious hip injury and had to stop and took up bike riding and enjoy that too. Not as much as running. I will always miss my time as a runner, but I said, hey, after the plane crash I had had this goal, this dream, this bucket list thing I've seen, if I can ride on that bicycle across the country. And after we lost, well, I thought, you know what? Bill, you better. You don't have long on the earth. And so go grab your dream. And so I said, I'm going to try to ride my bike across the country. Got the NCAA to give me an unpaid leave and wound up going out to California and put my rear wheel in the ocean in Huntington Beach and rode across the country in 36 days to Tybee Island, Georgia. Just remarkable, remarkable experience and course, my book grew out of that in Riding with The Blue Moth. The book has changed the lives of lots of people. We used to get a call once a month or so or even more frequent than that when it first came out from people who said, you turned my life around by your journey. And the book is a story. It's an adventure story of a clown trying to ride his bicycle across the country who doesn't know what he's doing. But also, it's a faith journey. I encountered lots of people across the country and talking to people I love to talk to people about their lives. I met some phenomenal people in small towns and in the rural part of the country who never hesitated to share their stories with me. I think I was pretty nonthreatening, skinny, sweaty guy on a bicycle. Once they decided that I wasn't crazy for riding my bike in the South in August, they share their time with me. And what I learned across the country is they're just wonderful people out there and had a lot of time on my own to contemplate what life would be like without our son and that maybe I could be in a position to help others. And so that was the awakening that you can help other folks who come into grief and you can live your life in such a way that people are going to want to know, as we say, want to know you and your God.
Justin Forman: So how is it? I mean, you're leading us right there, Bill. But what does that look like in that journey since then, when you integrate your faith, your work? Is it the conversations in the office? Is it the conversations with the coach? Is it stepping into some situations? What does it look like for you to live your faith and work?
Bill Hancock: Just live it every day and know that when you fall by the wayside, when you get frustrated, don't get angry, but sometimes get a little frustrated and know that when you fall by the wayside, you know, you can just come right back, get right back on the bike, get back on the path. I am not one to go and try to sell my faith except for the way I live. And people that I know who know me can watch the way I live. And so I don't have to talk about it. I can live it. And I think that's my opportunity is just to live it. So I do every day.
Henry Kaestner: So question on the faith, living your faith out at work for whatever reason. I'm thinking about the story about choosing the 13th apostle. So Judas is out of the picture. They get to get a new one and they decide to just pray about it and then roll lots or roll dice and figure out who's going to be the new apostle. Do you ever find yourself praying about the decisions you make as the head of the college football playoff, about maybe some of the difficult decisions about who to let in or maybe some of the people that led on the committee? Does prayer play a role in your life?
Bill Hancock: Professionally, yes, absolutely. But I don't pray for somebody to win a certain game and I don't pray for myself other than asking for strength. I pray every day, of course. And my prayer is to help me be strong. And then I have a prayer at least where I pray for people and for that's then kind of strength, you know, give Joe the strength to make a really hard decision or give Sally the strength to make the decision that will change many lives. That's my outlook.
Henry Kaestner: Justin going ask you a question here at the end about what you're learning from God's word. But I'm gonna ask you a random question that came up from something you mentioned just a little bit ago. Most people would not expect that they'd tune into Faith Driven Athlete podcast to talk to the executive director of the college football playoff and he would come up with three or four recommended tracks of classical music to listen to. But my sense is that you might have some. And so what would you have as a former concert clarinetist if that is such a word? Maybe this not even a word. But what are some tracks? What are some composers? What are some classical music that you turn to in times of. Just looking for beauty and inspiration for music.
Bill Hancock: Oh, my goodness. Yes. Mozart and a French horn concertos Beethoven. All kinds of Beethoven piano sonatas. The fifth chorus in the ninth fourth movement of the Ninth Symphony. What I'm about to get ready to leave for heaven, I'm going to say, can I just listen to the fourth movement of Beethoven's Ninth one last time? Chopin. I love Chopin waltzes and then then also Broadway. I'm a big Broadway person and if we have time on the podcasts, I could do every line of the music man right now myself. I could do the whole thing, probably. Oh, it's probably my fair lady. I could probably do every single line. Wow. But yeah. Classical music was it for me and still is. And then I got into Broadway and just fell in love with that too. I'll tell you what else. The great hymns. When I finally came back to a little bit of life after we lost our son, I would go into worship. I would only sit in the back and because every time we sang one of the great hymns, it would make me cry and I'd have to leave and go out and compose myself and then come back. I just love those classic we call them warhorses, the hymns that we all grew up with.
Henry Kaestner: Is there one that stands out?
Bill Hancock: Oh holy, holy, holy is one we have in our Methodist hymnal. How great thou art. Of course. Joyful, joyful. We adore thee. Just so many. And I keep a hymn book on my piano at home and if I want to do some reading. I just open it up and I'll play through a few hymns.
Justin Forman: So you talk about Bill that you mentioned being around faith kind of through osmosis, that you think some of that in early on at a young age was a little bit about the moment when it started to become real. You mentioned that by the time the tragic events in Will's passing that you had that foundation. But talk to us a little bit about that journey in between.
Bill Hancock: Yeah. You know, I don't remember an overnight feeling. I just remember every day, every week in church was in our DNA and worship was in it just slowly came to me. That really that all you need is a golden rule. And if you let that guide your life, then you're going to change others lives in ways that you can't even imagine. So it's just always been there for me, always from my earliest memories. Many of them are going to worship, going to choir practice and watching my dad lead the choir. It's always been there. Mm hmm.
Justin Forman: Bill, we're grateful for the time that you've spent with us. You know, one of the places where we'd like to finish each episode is just really rooted in God's word and to saying what is a passage of scripture? Maybe that's kind of life to you. This morning. This week. Is there a specific part of scripture in what God's teaching you right now that you could share with our listeners?
Bill Hancock: You know, every scripture about love and justice and caring for each other. I don't want to cite one in particular because I might leave out some. But the Bible is full of love. And that's what has guided my life. And I know it does many, many millions of others.
Henry Kaestner: Bill, thank you very much for being with us. This has been a special blessing. It was outstanding. And I am going to be going to the fourth movement, the ninth I've for instance, every time I listen to the Hallelujah chorus, I always tear up the money.
Bill Hancock: Yeah, I should have mentioned that.
Henry Kaestner: Yeah, but thank you for your leadership in a sport that we all love. And it's a big deal the way that you impact culture and you do it in a way that you're able to love on people. And there must be a lot of pressure with what you do and the same time you lead with class. And thank you for sharing about the story about your son and what encouragement that's been for other people are dealing with coping in tragedy and disgraceful for your time.
Bill Hancock: Well, you're welcome. And thank you for the opportunity you all did. Great. You're pros in every way. So I give you two thumbs up.